In-Tim-idation
Submitted by gregflynn on Tue, 07/17/2007 - 8:17am
Most people write "Thank You" notes to express their gratitude. Tim Kent of the North Carolina Association of Realtors takes out 2/3 page ads in newspapers like this one for Dan Blue in "The Carolinian". Between the PAC ($750,000) the 527 ($350,000) and direct lobbying by NCAR ($500,000) when you've got $1.6 million to spend on legislators there are some things you just can't say with flowers, Hallmark or a horse's head.
With friends like this who needs enemies. We hear that legislators are afraid of opposition from the NC Realtors when they run for re-election. I say re-election to do what? Is there something more progressive they are planning on doing and just haven't gotten around to this session? Once you get inside the black limo your chances of returning to progressive politics are slim to non-existent. The time to act is now. Stand up to the PAC attack and support Local Options for Local Governments.
Tick.
The kiss of death.
Do good. Be nice. Have fun.
Ticks carry diseases.
Limos carry legislators who once were good guys.
Dan Blue what happened?
Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi
I've heard that alot of NC legislators
ARE Realtors
Maybe that's a problem?
Progressives are the true conservatives.
Croneyism
Like I said with friends like this who needs enemies? Look at the properties of a file in my mailbox. I have a PDF copy of Talking Points: Response to Partnership for NC’s Future.
Brad Crone's Campaign Connections has gotten over $100,000 this year from the NC Realtors. As Leslie H said:
One of those talking points from the "2nd District Chair"?
We've got a spending problem all right, a PAC spending problem. Like I said with friends like this who needs enemies?
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
That's awesome Greg.
Sunshine, what a concept.
John Edwards is great!
- Sam Spencer, BlueNC, 7/3/07
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Brad Crone must go.
What a phenomenally useless %*#(%*^& piece of work. This is what we're fighting, ya'll ... canyon deep pockets on one side and a shocking lack of integrity on the other. Yes, I would call that political "me-first" attitude a shocking lack of integrity.
If you haven't written your Senator, and Dan Blue ... write. Please.
"They took all the trees and put them in a tree museum Then they charged the people a dollar 'n a half just to see 'em. Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone? They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."
Wait, hold up -
The Second District Chair is Brad Thompson.
Serious?
Then who is Brad Crone? I know I've met him. Where are my wires messed up? (and Thanks, CD.)
Edited to add: Just googled images. You're right. Different guy. I'm a moron. My BAD!! Sorry Brad Thompson. You can hit me when you see me August 9th.
"They took all the trees and put them in a tree museum Then they charged the people a dollar 'n a half just to see 'em. Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone? They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."
Some info from online.
Interesting article from 2002. I'll let people draw their own conclusions from these excerpts.
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Actually, I didn't mean folks should draw conclusions....
This was just the information I fell upon while searching for him on the Google.
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Sounds like one of those tools
Who thinks books like "Who Moved My Cheese" are really profound.
War is over if you want it.
War is over if you want it.
Thanks
I can't amend the comment but Brad Crone is still billed as a "Democratic political consultant".
Brad Thompson is a former Raleigh City Councilor, totally different person.
The point remains. As Robert P. said in the other thread about Crone: "He makes his living off of state races". Here's a guy advising Democratic candidates in State races producing right-wing talking points. He appears on NC Spin as a "Democratic political consultant" presumably to provide input from the "left". Now I have to filter all his comments, and those on transfer tax in particular, with the knowledge that his firm is getting $100K+ to oppose the transfer tax with Civitas talking points..
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
The people who fall for this stuff are so blind.
Maybe we should push for a PAC tax. They have to pay 1% into a public campaign finance "war-chest" for every dollar they spend on issues ads.
Here - I'll frame it for them. Let's call it the free speech tax. Wait - only individuals are granted free speech by the Constitution, not organizations. Heh. The heck with 'em.
Tax them for every ad.
Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi
Now We Know, Don't We?
Clarification
Let me get this straight, when you say:
Are you saying that (1) Tim Kent, his PAC, the 527 and/or the direct lobbying arm of NCAR have spent money on Dan Blue (presumably on something other than "flowers, Hallmark or a horse's head" and, (2) because of these lobbying efforts, Representative Blue has changed a position?
And when you say:
Are you saying that (1) Representative Blue is the bad friend or (2) Tim Kent and NCAR is the bad friend? And are you suggesting that Representative Blue has gotten "inside the black limo" and has abandoned progressive politics?
I don't know what he is saying.
However, Tim Kent and the NCAR are bad for North Carolina, they are bad for our schools, they are bad for our children. The only thing they care about is their own continued profit, in some misbegotten belief that the transfer fee will hurt their business.
And, intentional or not, being the recipient of a full-page newspaper ad thanking him for standing with NCAR and not the children of North Carolina is the kind of thing that makes one wonder if Michael Moore did a film about this whole debacle, what kind of price tag would we find floating above Rep. Blue's head?
Perhaps we will soon find ads like this in many newspapers as they continue to spend there million dollars of lobbying money to fight against better schools for the children of North Carolina, all in the name of profits.
Profits over people - that is supposed to be the Republican mantra, not ours.
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
WE are sick of this.
What the hell....
We're sick of feeling sold out so that EVERY BUSINESS can try to be ranked higher, while kids and schools and education and health care are treated like DIRT. SICK OF IT.
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Yeah. Number One for Whom!?
'trickle down' my ***
(Aunt Fanny)
I wish I'd said that!
Trickle down
is a euphemism for the drizzlin' $h*ts, as my very Democratic granddaddy would have said.
A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history.
Mohandas Gandhi
A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history.
Mohandas Gandhi
I like the chart.
Can you give me a link to the source? Pretty please?
Don't know what gregflynn is saying
but I do know what the NCAR is saying in that ad:
If that's not correct we'ld like to hear the real story.
We're a little street ball politics around here... so props for showing up, but seriously ... give it to us straight. What else is it the Honorable Dan Blue would like us to know? If you can take, we can take it. What's the real problem with this Transfer Tax issue if it isn't the threat of a wealthy PAC running issue ads against Senators in 2008?
"They took all the trees and put them in a tree museum Then they charged the people a dollar 'n a half just to see 'em. Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone? They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."
Blue
Nice try with the deposition derby. I'm not up for singing "Ten green rebuttals hanging on the wall".
I have a lot of respect for Dan Blue, which is why it is disconcerting to see ads like this with attribution to the NC Association of Realtors buried in small print in the grey border. I'm not aware of any vote he needed to be "thanked" for. This may be totally disingenuous on the part of the NC Realtors. On the other hand of contributions reported by Dan Blue in the short space between appointment and Dec 31st 2006 ($14,200) some 28% came from realtors ($3,000) and builders ($1,000).
I write to provide information and to stimulate thought and discussion. If you see double meanings in my statements there's probably a third buried in there somewhere.
I could write an essay in response to one of your questions. It's more important to know that this propaganda war exists and to examine how it is being implemented and affecting our politics and ultimately our lives.
It is more important to know that moneyed realtors are framing the debate and polluting our politics. They are are floating right-wing talking points buoyed by Democrats. They are labeling progressive Democrats as allies.
What exactly is this ad and ads like it across the State? Is it electioneering communication by a corporate entity? Is it an endorsement of the "honoree" or is it an endorsement by the "honoree" of the policies of the NC Association of Realtors. Like your own comment there seem to be more questions than answers.
It's not as important to divine what I mean by cross-examination as it is to recognize that multi-valent messages are floating out there to the public and Democrats and the Party need to be doing something about it, especially those targeted by these ads. Otherwise, people will believe whatever the NC Realtors, with the help of Judas Crone, want them to believe.
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
OK, I'm confused
and I'm getting angrier about that ad by the minute. Is the NCAR paying to run a flat out lie in the paper to hurt a progressive Democrat in a solid blue district?
"They took all the trees and put them in a tree museum Then they charged the people a dollar 'n a half just to see 'em. Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone? They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."
Dear Confused,
I think confusion is the name of the game. Blue is not the only target. If Dan B can furnish any insight on the position of the other Dan B now would be a good time to help clear up some of the confusion.
And when I say that Brad Crone is a Demoratic consultant I mean that he is a Democratic consultant
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
I was genuinely asking for clarification, Gregg
I do realize that not every post with a litany of questions is seeking for clarification. My post was sincerely to get a better understanding of what you were saying because there is a lot there.
My issue is not with the ad or the vote; it's the chain of logic that says: (1) if the NCAR runs an ad, even if it's a generic ad, thanking a candidate for supporting one of their positions, then (2) that candidate must be getting PAC money from NCAR. It's extremely close to that all-too-familiar refrain of "you're either against us or you're with the terrorists." It may simply be that we disagree on how to engage in stimulating discussion.
I am not defending NCAR or Tim Kent. I'm certain sure that your passion comes from the fact that you are there roaming the halls of the General Assembly, and you are able to see first-hand the undue influence of PAC money, corporations, and special interest groups on legislation and the legislative process. However, I'm also certain that Representative Blue has his own reasons for disagreeing with the transfer tax as it has been presented and I'm equally certain that the NCAR and its PAC had nothing to do with his decision. Whether they are technical reasons (like voting against it while it's in the middle of a much larger, unrelated bill) or for a principled reason (like using it fund the state's Medicaid burden) or for some other reason that has nothing to do with NCAR or its interest in protecting its 6%, I am very disturbed that a $1,000 ad by NCAR is enough to get a progressive blog to throw a progressive representative "under the bus" with accusations.
At the same time, I do understand that this is what we're left with... this the true cost of Jim Black, Thomas Wright and every other politician that has been corrupted over the last few years in NC politics. Or Duke Cunningham, William Jefferson, and every other dirty politician that takes advantage of corporate cash or is forced to vote out of fear of corporate cash.
While I do understand your frustration, but would it be so hard to call or email Representative Blue before you draw the wrong conclusions? If you respect him, as you say you do and which I do believe, talk to him. Respect his right to come out on the other side of an issue for policy reasons, but don't jump to insult his integrity in a blog, even if it is a way to stimulate conversation. Not every one on Jones Street is a crook.
And as for the ad, I think you are correct in your follow-up post to suggest that there is a propaganda war and that issues are being carefully framed. Even framing the issue as collecting transfer taxes versus raising property taxes is a way of obscuring the what's at stake.
i think you have missed
the argument.
Its not an if 1 then 2. It is a if 1 and 2 are both separately true, then ?
"Keep the Faith"
"Keep the Faith"
Blue South
I may be particularly slow at the moment, but I have absolutely no idea what you meant by that.
Neither do I : )
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Nevermind... I think I've got it.
On second reading (and actually looking back at what I posted), I think I see what you mean.
No, I'm definitely not saying 1 and 2 are true separately (and I'm hoping that was a joke). As Gregg pointed out in one of his responses, there are representatives and senators receiving these "thank you" notes from NCAR. There are a variety of legitimate and progressive reasons why a representative or senator could end up voting on the same side as NCAR. Unless you believe that no matter how the transfer tax is presented or worded, no matter where it shows up in a bill or amendment, and no matter what it is up against, the only progressive position is to vote for it. And any vote against the transfer tax--any vote at all--is a vote that NCAR can thank.
I am, however, saying that just because NCAR thanks a representative for a vote, it does not necessarily follow that the representative has sold his or her integrity for a few thousand dollars.
Just for clarification
gregflynn and Gregg are two different people on BlueNC.
: )
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Doh
You got me there. I was talking about gregflynn. While the blog has the "Preview Comment" button, I need a "Don't Post Comment Until I've Spellchecked, Proofread, and Rethought It Once More" button.
hee!
We all could use one of those now and again.
Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi
B
The short answer is Tim Kent/ NCAR. Everthing else is open to interpretation until Dan Blue, other Dems and/or Jerry Meek come out with some response to these heavy handed tactics. Until then the realtors are speaking for them on this issue.
Frankly, I don't know what position Dan Blue has taken. Even if I knew it precisely it wouldn't make any difference to the 100's of people that see that ad and similar ads across the State. This love letter from NCAR states that he took one consistent with NCAR policy.
I want people to see how NCAR is manipulating the debate. If people have copies of ads targeting other Dems I'd be happy to post them also.
No mainstream source that I know of has reprinted any of the material targeting legislators and all the printed reports I have seen have legislators staying off the record on this subject. It's been taboo. I don't rate my chances of getting someone on the record any higher than the Capital Press Corps.
I didn't draw any conclusions about Dan Blue. I haven't thrown a progressive under the bus. If anything I'm trying to drag them out from under one. Progressives need to know that they don't have to suffer in silence. I'm here to shine some light on the subject. It can't be taboo to discuss this openly and asserting that I'm "insulting his integrity" will not keep the genie in the bottle.
I didn't draw a chain of logic from 1 to 2. As it happens the PAC did give money but as it happens they give money to almost everybody so the point would be moot - if I was trying to make it.
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
PS
I have read and re-read my original post and find little of what has been read into it.
NCAR is intimidating legislators using ads like this. Dan Blue may or may not be intimidated by NCAR but some legislators are afraid of opposition to their re-election. Counties like Bertie as well as Wake need revenue options. You don't have to support a transfer tax to support letting counties decide for themselves how they want to tax themselves.
To those who are intimidated I say: What do you expect to achieve, if re-elected, that you can not or will not do now? If this is this about keeping Democratic majorities in the Legislature then the Party should weigh in. Letting NCAR decide is not providing counties with the options they need for their own problems.
Stop the NC Association of Realtors
Polluting our State Legislature with money.
Dan Blue is going to be speaking at Sanford Hunt
- - - - -
Where Liddy At?
Where is Liddy?
Anyone seen Liddy?
- - - - -
http://twitter.com/Jerimee
Gosh already?
Well, I'm waiting for my bloggers press credentials and free tickets ;)
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
Don't Hold Your Breath
$250 is a lot of air.
$30 for "general admission"
Well worth it if it lives up to last year.
One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon
Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me
A Nod is as Good as a Wink
to a blind horse ...