Shuler v. Miller: See what our western friends are saying
Submitted by James on Mon, 08/30/2010 - 9:31am
There's a lively discussion going on in Asheville about the merits of voting for Blue Dog Shuler versus staying home and letting the race get decided by others. If I were in the district, I'd end up voting for Shuler, grudgingly, though I certainly wouldn't support him in any other way. For me, the same sentiment probably applies to Kissell in the 8th, though that would be a harder call. Kissell has not only been a disappointment in terms of voting, he's also ignored a whole bunch of good people who worked their asses off to help get him elected.
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Vote against Shuler and McIntyre.
They are self-identified Blue Dogs that serve only to block and weaken progressive legislation.
Their heads in the political trashbin will do more to further progressive legislation and spark fear in the hearts of their spineless leaders, than holding 2 seats for the witless federal Democratic majority.
Didn't find Shuler on this list
Pulling from my post in an earlier thread:
Even those Representatives who have failed like Congressman Kissell whose short comings are obvious, and Congressman Etheridge who recently voted against repealing DADT, still have some redeeming votes.
Does Congressman Shuler?
I live in the 11th
There is no doubt that Heath has disappointed time and time again.
Not having anything to base this on other than perhaps personal cynicism, it wouldn't surprise me very much to see Shuler switching to the GOP after the election if he wins. If the balance in the House is close, the Boehner crowd will certainly target him.
In my mind Shuler's only redeeming value is his stance on most environmental issues, including finally settling the North Shore road issue. Chainsaw Charlie Taylor let that linger and fester for way too long, never taking a stand.
Bottom line is I will probably hold my nose and vote for Heath, simply to be able to hang on to the Speaker's chair in the House. But I certainly won't do like I did on election day in 2006, when I carried a sign for him and Joe Sam Queen all day in the rain at my precinct.
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Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- sign on Einstein's office wall.
looking more & more likely that John Boehner will become Speaker
http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/
Its kind of scary that this is potential reality is coming closer to fruition and being talked about more and more.
Holding your nose and voting = Zero Leverage
n/t
Speaker Boehner = negative leverage
n/t
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Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- sign on Einstein's office wall.
Is Shuler assuring us he's voting for Democratic leadership?
That is the point of this fear-mongering argument, isn't it?
Shuler even fails this test. He's not even a sure vote for a Democratic Speaker.
And voting out of fear, well... it's just not something I suggest.
If I get a chance....
...I will ask him point-blank.
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Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- sign on Einstein's office wall.
As I understand it
What Rep Shuler and others are looking at doing, Bobby Bright of Alabama is one of them, is not planing on a party switch nor are they planning to support a Republican for speaker, but they are open to having a Blue Dog become speaker with Republican support, that is assuming the Democrats lose the 30 to 35 seats most see them doing now, but most likely it will be to withold support of Pelosi and force her to stand down, and allow Steny Hoyer to become the new speaker.
It really doesn't matter
The D behind the name, whether it's Pelosi or Hoyer or Bright or Shuler, is nothing but a huge target for the birthers, baptizers, and BS'ers who monopolize the right-wing media machine.
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Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- sign on Einstein's office wall.
Thanks for making my argument
For context:
When this was done in the NC House of Representative in 1989, Joe Mavretic and a coalition of conservative-in-title-but-not-in-action Democrats and Republicans came to power.
This Dem-Repub coalition -- which included a young Roy Cooper -- promptly busted the state's budget by acting UNconservatively. Specifically, they used a wildly inappropriate budget growth rate to anticipate income to balance their budget. The projection they knew was unrealistic...turned out to be wrong. Stunning, I know.
Said another way, the mountain populists and liberals in control prior to Mavretic (Liston Ramsey and others) actually budgeted MORE conservatively than the "conservatives" and kept the state's books in better order.
Only after Mavretic and the Republicans were tossed -- and two sessions of Speaker Dan Blue and others fixing the state's fiscal house, where things put back in order.
Lesson: Decimate the Blue Dog caucus. Whether you think you're a liberal Democrat or a conservative Democrat, Blue Dogs do nothing but screw you in the end.
Shuler and McIntyre are self-identified Blue Dogs. Vote against them.
We see do not see the same things
I recall Speaker Blue to be a total disaster, who after screwing things up so bad gave the GOP control of the house, then later in 1999 tired to have his own coalition with the GOP, but anyway I understand the Blue Dog/GOP coalition will only happen if Pelosi does not step down, which she probably will do if she thinks she is going to lose and Hoyer will be the new Speaker.
Rahm Emanuel gave the GOP control of the US and NC House
And he's doing it again 16 years later.
Speaker Blue and his team restored the state's fiscal house. That's my point.
I guess I should mention Etheridge since he's a Hoyer fan, and was in the NC House back in the 80s too. One wonders if he remembers the lessons of 1989.
All I recall Speaker Blue
Doing was trying to get in the way of just about everything Gov Hunt was trying to reform. I do not recall Rham role 16 years ago, but I do remeber Dan Blue's as for now I am not sure that our current speaker in either Raleigh nor Washington has done much to help Democrats.
Let me refresh your memory
Governor Hunt was elected in 1992. Martin was still governor during Blue's first session as Speaker.
Rahm served in Clinton's White House (beginning in 1993) just as he is serving in Obama's. And he's doing the same crappy job he did last time.
Sorry for the double post...
...my browser hung up or something.
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Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- sign on Einstein's office wall.